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tv   The Dylan Ratigan Show  MSNBC  June 12, 2012 1:00pm-2:00pm PDT

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dylan ratigan is here to talk us into the next hour. >> like a london day in town. >> it's terrible. we were looking at our camera at the white house and you couldn't see the white house. we decided not to even use the shot during our forecast and there you've got times square. look at it. dank, dark. just like london. >> just like home. >> i'm so -- i apologize. i apologize. >> i'll see you tomorrow. >> have a good show, dylan. >> show starts next. beautiful tuesday afternoon to you. today's big story, the london whale. you may have read of this character. he is jpmorgan's strader based in london, that's the name, whose risky trades ultimately
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may cost the company as much $7 billion but the price for jamie dimon and jpmorgan and the banking sector maybe bigger than that because when the blunder became public in april, it sparked a free fall that has cost shareholders $30 billion and now there is new evidence that the man in charge, the unindictable jamie dimon, was warned about the risks of the london whale positions two years prior and ignored them. that news should make jamie dimon's scheduled testimony at the senate banking committee tomorrow very interesting. we also learned today that since the the '08 crash, jpmorgan has received nearly $400 billion in zero interest federal loans on printed money from you and me effectively that was revealed in government records made public for the first time ever thanks
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to our first guest today, senator sanders in sarratt sarratt. along the way, jamie dimon in recent years has paid himself into the tens of millions of dollars. meanwhile, the average american family's value has gone down 40%. if you were on the committee tomorrow, what would your first question be? >> first question would be haven't you learned anything from what wall street did four years ago where your recklessness and greed drove this country into a terrible recession. why don't you start investing in the productive economy, create jobs rather than just enrich yourself. >> and i suspect he would respond by saying we have c conceived going back to bill clinton and bob reuben and the founding of the euro, the world's most efficient distributed risk network and it is highly in tact, complex and if anything, the regulations of people like washington, d.c. are
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making it more difficult for us to do this than not. that would be a characterization of a likely response from jamie. >> i think that's pretty much what he would say and i think our answer is that our highly complicated gamble ethics are not creating jobs in america. we need a fundamental change in the culture of wall street so that you are investing in the productive economy helping us grow jobs, produce products, services. and we don't need anymore of these complicated gambling procedures. the second point that i would make on committee. is to say to him, you are on the new york fed during the financial crisis. and your company, jpmorgan chase received $380 billion in very low interest loans. don't you perceive that as a
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conflict of interest? why do you think that people representing the banking industry should be on new york fed and others when the function of the banks among other things o regulate the financial institutions? >> and i want to come back to the revision of the opportunity seeking intent of wall street. it's supposed to be an opportunity seeking culture, it's become obviously a risk taking and gambling culture. i want to come back to that. you don't have to understand gamble i gambling and tubt seeking and risk derivatives to understand conflict of interest. you've got the same guy basically paying himself out using taxpayer money in charge of supervising himself. kindergartner could tell you that's going to lead to zas e. >> i would think so. but let's be clear. this is not just jamie dimon. you've got 17, according to the gao, who at my request, did a study of the conflicts of interest at the fed. you have 17 other individuals
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past and present members of feds who collectively, 18 of them collectively, their financial institutions received $4 trillion in very low interest loans during the bailout period. so, again, if this is not the fox guarding the the hen house, then i don't know what is. >> we've been at this for a few years. you know item going to conclude this a week from friday and we've sort of be at this a while. the unrevolved portion of this going back to when i left cnbc in 2008 continues to be the same thing it was when i left, senator. which is that the -- acknowledge the risk of the gambling complexity and it's clear that they need to break up the banks and revise these issues as intact. we've done it before and we know nobody wants to do it because it is incredibly disruptive to the
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banlgs banks, to the short-term flow of money. it is disruptive to a lot of -- with that bomb, senator and disassemble. >> dylan, i don't agree. i think when you have six financial institutions in this country that have assets equivalent to two-thirds of the gdp of a united states that have unbelievable political power, i think it is a no brainer to say that for the sake of our economy, productive economy and in order to prevent another too big to fail, you have got to break these banks up. the reason you're not doing that, you're not seeing that action here in congress is simply having to do with the enormous power of wall street. and if you want to stand up to these guys, they're going to go get you. there are going to be a lot of
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television ads come at you. >> the complexity argument as far as you're concerned is a smoke screen. the real problem, the financial will control the banlgs over washington okay. appreciate that. i have no reason to dispute that. it makes a tremendous amount of sense. one more question, which really ties to this whole thing. as you know, in 1998, 1999, 2000, commodity futures, glass-steagall repeal, they've seen the inside job, read the books, more educated. the exact same people who c conceived of that for the united states also conceived of the euro zone. it is the same birthplace that was from that reuben greenspan clinton period which was again, i believe -- whether it was malicious or not, you'll never know. it was an experiment that has clearly failed, okay?
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and the bill for that is coming due. right now, the bill is is being paid by the southern european poor people suffering without jobs. right now, there's three basically rich uncles that are in play to pay this bill off. the first rich uncle is the ecb and dragy. dragy's been keeping this thing running. he basically is saying i can't keep doing this. then the new york fed, then you have washington, d.c. they don't want to pay for it, which leaves you with angela merkel and the bavarians and entire german economy, which has the most inspiring, most efficient, most well run locally driven distributed power. why on earth should the germans pay the bill for bob reuben and greenspan's experiment just because they have a high efficiently power generation facility? >> i think that is a fair question and i think also, by
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the way, what you're seeing in europe, france and germany, greece, is that ordinary people who are really have been terribly hard hit by this recession, unemployment off the the wall. cutbacks in pensions and health care. ordinary people are saying hey, maybe it's time to reverse this austerity thing. let's see austerity for the big banks and wealthiest people in our countries and in the world and not just working people. >> but let's be honest on what that means for the big banks. austerity for them is a global debt restructuring where you don't restructure at the ek pence of the pension holder, but at the expense of the sovereign debt holder and or the second leli holder, which language is not widely sort of chattered about in media circles, but i know you understand it, senator and you either restructure it at the expense of the people or the
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banks and that's been done, but only after war. >> you are really at a pivotal moment in my view in modern world history and we've got to deal with these issues. in our country, we have an incredibly unfair, unequal distribution of wealth and income and you're having that increasingly all over the world and what ordinary people are saying something has to happen, but you can't keep beating up on working families who are seeing a significant decline in their standard of living. something else is going to have to pay for this and it can't be just the average person. >> listen, you have a long career and a proud voice. i was proud to be able to learn from you over the past few years, glad i got a chance to talk to you again. >> congratulations to all the great work you've done. see you in another venue, i'm sure. >> cable news, it won't be, but television for sure. we'll do some tv for sure. maybe in a -- get a new show.
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we've talked enough. got to get boots on here. show, don't tell. talk to you soon, senator. >> thank you. coming up, the megapanel takes on war and peace. bloodshed escalating in syria, but a new study suggests that is not the trend on this planet. assad, mubarak and gadhafi, it's been a tough year for the world dictator crowd. why the totalitarian of the world are in trouble and what they're seeming to maintain their totality. plus, a little training for your brain and maybe a little for mine. the neurorow biologist from head games explains why our grasp of the world may not be as sound as we all think and he's here to prove it and improve it in the hours to come. you want to save money on car insurance?
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u.n. officials confirms today what the rest of the world has been fearing for months. syria, more r or less on the full scale civil war. >> started out as particularly worried about the recent shelling of homs as well as reports of the use of mortar, helicopters and tanks in the town of -- that our indications that a large number of civilians are trapped in these towns. those comments coming at the same time we're seeing heavy shelling in several districts in syria along with new loud explosions being reported now as
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we chitchat in cable land in damascus. showing neighborhoods in the city of homs under attack. think of this like boston or philadelphia. it's an outrage. this is a -- the death toll at more than 13,000 civilians, residents, since the uprising began some 15 months ago. what is the community to do? the tuesday megapanel is here. karen, susan and jimmy. hello, my friends. nice to see you. let's set -- let's take a couple of things for granted. we've covered this enough at this point. we know that the primary leverage in syria, those outside syria, it's either russia or china. you can complain to the president or the european in europe. the power of money in syria comes through that part of the world.
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listen to hillary clinton today, our secretary of state on russia and whatever leverage we may be able to accumulate. >> we have in front of the russia russians, stopping their continued arms shipments to syria. they have from time to time said that we shouldn't worry. are we tahinking the shipping i unrelated to their actions internally. that's untrue. and we are concerned about the latest information we have that there are attack helicopters on the way from russia to syria. >> how much does this escalate that the u.s. secretary of state is directly confronting russia, exclusively. she says we have confronted the russians about stopping their continued arms shipment. that would seem by my measure, a meaningful diplomatic escalation. >> absolutely. particularly if you consider like putin's telling you don't
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worry about it. this is a guy who just passed regulations so people can't protest anymore. russia and china have been to two holdouts supporting syria. >> fntsing and weaponization. >> and now there are these reports of they might be sending helicopters, it shifts the dynamic with regard to the other u.n. countries in terms of the consideration of which actions to take. you don't just have russia defending syria, but now, they're helping. >> then you have america, susan, now publicly with their secretary of state, confronting the nation of russia, explicitly for doing this. >> right. and it's significant because we have reports that now they're seeing cities all around the country being bombed and that the command and control of the syrian government is faltering. people aren't quigetting paid, they're not getting supplies. so now, we have to question what is our role. does it make sense now, do we
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consider arming them? do we consider that, do we hold more pressure on russia? >> and i guess that's the -- last word on this, jimmy, all tea leaf reading by its very nature dealing with asymmetric information. we have new information, which is the secretary of state and the confirmation of russian arms shipments and the confirmation of helicopters and the confirmation of expanded military engagement. what's the next phase inside of the washington, d.c. as though tonight, at the state department, tomorrow, what are they meeting about? what's on the -- what sort of things? >> i think they have to decide whether they go to the u.n. and say we go to the u.n. and barack obama stands up and says hi, you can't arm people that are killing their own people. it's not okay if you do. >> or else what? that's a big move. >> they're sending helicopters which the government is using to kill people.
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>> right. >> it's helicopters. >> also iran, right, because iran and syria -- >> or else what? >> my point is you have to call them out. what secretary clinton did is a huge deal. barack obama going to the u.n. and giving a speech. >> susan rice would do it. >> don't they have to get the arab league to agree it's time to do something? >> before the president speaks because you don't want him to speak without an apparatus. >> arab league can do that. you can have john mccain and lindsey graham on barack obama's butt on this issue. it is time for the president, i'm there, to call the u.n. in and say you've got to stop this stuff. got to stop it. >> i think -- >> no, no, no. >> i want barack obama to go to the u.n. and say to the russian and chinese in their faces, stop arming these people so they can stop killing their people. >> i mean, no, so but the
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emotion, but let's -- in practical reality, the chinese and russian government have already exhibited through their actions, for get what we think, that they are more than happy to provide fuel, financing and access to the syrian government. they have already been publicly shamed. more and more people around the world are more aware like what's going on with syria, oh, it's the russians and chinese on the back door, same way america's the back door on saudi arabia or egypt and everybody's got these set-ups and who does syria belong? >> iran. >> and so the question is we have secretary of state escalating against them, but it's unclear what the arab league leverage is with russia and china. we can pay for anything. we've got drones. we know that we can do that, we just don't know whether it's effective. >> i think it's a matter of it's not just as simple as going and
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saying you can't arm these guys. if you do that, we will take action. >> what is your action? >> you have to be able to say you have the arab league, you have the u.n. >> or else what. >> we'll send forces in. >> do you arm the rebels or not? right now seems to be the only options on the table. you can have the coalition, everyone for it, but what the it is, do you arm thep them or not. >> i would argue there's a different potential if, i don't know if it exists, that's the worst you described, there's got to be another it or maybe there's not, that is some global coalition that levers china and russia to say stop sending money and i just don't know what that is. >> that's the not. either you do it or try and find a different solution. >> i would say maybe -- australia, disrupt their mineral supply and cut off china. there's got to be a way to play games with these people that
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doesn't require shooting each other dead. which we know doesn't work. >> that's one of the conversation that happens. okay, let's get together. what are leverage points with russia before we escalate to shooting. what have we got? >> and what's syria going to do, oh, we're just going to pick another -- >> then you do a scenario analysis once you do the interv interval. what is the next warning look like in syria if we get the deal we want and what's the contingency for that. >> i am glad that i don't have to be in that meeting. yeah. and i am immensely emp thetic. i'm hopeful there are people that know a lot more than us. >> certainly hope so. >> one thing is for sure, it is not easy being a dictator. after this, a conversation with our specialist on the highly efficient networks helping those in search of freedom even if
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. for over four decade, the people have lived under a tyrant. >> the time has come for him to step aside. >> we must keep on with the nato mission and bring him to justice. >> turns out our friend sacha baron cohen is not the only one making a comeback as a dictator. our specialist says the next great battle for freedom is takitake ing place between dictators and those trying to exploit modern tools. you see, now leaders have learned to use a more nuanced version of coerce of force with
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their bloody tactics now caught on camera and uploaded to the world, our next guest says they're more active to be active in the u.n. and speak out on human rights and pretend to run democracies and in a way that nobody knows that it's not and with that, those who are truly fighting to preserve freedom, without the action of a free society is a critical distinction that is not always made between political leadership and the actual culture of the william dobson spent years traveling, writes about it in his new book the dictator's learning curve inside the global battle for democracy. your premise is interesting and i want to make sure i understand
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it. dictators are getting more sophisticated in using messaging and placation maneuvers and communications to create the am biance of freedom in your brain. i'll switch the leader, do these things. those who want freedom because they need no resources and can connect in shame and it's like a different sort of a cold war between the communications arts of the centralizes powers of the world and the communications art of the distributed network trying to free itself. is that fair? >> sounds as though you almost wrote the book yourself. >> well, i fortunately didn't, but have been studying, this is the thing, right? this is not just a dictator thing. this is the world. a battle between those who are pretending and using centralized power and sec rerecy. it's what we've been doing the past three years. do you want secrets in two sets or honesty in one set. give us a sense of the saying
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and doing gap between dictators and protesters. >> sure. well, i mean, you said it very well here. and the panel mentioned it in your discussion before the break. what did putin do last week? last week, he went to the parliament like presidents might, to have a law passed that would help swelt protests. but he didn't just -- >> democracy. >> exactly. he didn't go around and just make mass arrests. this isn't a violent crackdown. we haven't seen a violent crackdown since the protests really started to get momentum last december. he is actually even come out and said that if this, these protests are product of my government, then i'm proud of them. so he is welcomed them. and that is very much what you see of the more savvy, nimble, sophisticated dictator of today. they speak of human rights. speak
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commissions and investigate crimes. never mind they're the ones behind the crimes, but they will go through this and you know, it's important to understand this is more than just a facade. east germany, one of the most totalitarian regimes of the cold war, the german democratic republic. that was just a bland facade. these are regimes that understand that it's actually useful to have an opposition because it soaks up some of the dissent. they create a sophisticated architecture and then manicure and cultivate it to really with stand these pressures. >> sounds like basically a communication strategy saying listen, we're going to retain power. we're going to use modern communications to create the am by of justice. >> the question that i have is at the same time, it does feel that groups are actually also
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catching up and that so much of the activism we've seen has been tibl hold these guys accountable. we saw that in tunisia where there organizations like and others trying to empower those groups popping up. can you talk about what the counter to the dictatordictator. >> i traveled more than 93,000 miles over these two and a half years going to these different countries to report and meet the people challenges the regimes. i also met with the people working for the regimes. what you find is there's a very global, dynamic cat and mouse game being played where each side evolves, imemploys a tactic of some sort. so in the case, one of my favorite examples, the case of venezuela. really there is the only place
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w where chafs chavez has lost, at the hands of the student movement. why? because they were incredibly creative. con santly coming up with new tactics and explaining what the political project is all about that had nothing to do with politics. one of the terms used was humor. they would say we're proud of the number of miss universes we've created. now imagine what chavez really wants. imagine the miss universe or if misvenezuela was the same person every year. they created aged images and said that what he wants. this was hard for the regime to counter because if they're going to use the language of democracy, really work to their polarizing message. this is a lot of this. it's effective political messaging. >> sort of like jamie dimon running the new york federal reserve while he runs his own
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bank. show pictures of that. hang on a second, what's running what around here? that will be our miss america pictures. go ahead, susan. >> my question is actually on the flip side of karen's. how these dictators are able to stay in power in this day and age. it seems to me that we look at syria, they're only able to do what they're doing because of russia and iran. and you look at other countries, you could argue you had mubarak there because the u.s. allowed him to stay for such a long period of time. so what's the life of these dictators now that we're in a more globalized world? >> right. i talked to some of mubarak's advisers nine months before the regime collapsed and these were k very koft men. they believed they had figured out a formula. the man was in power for 30 years. that wasn't easily done. what they did and they spoke to me about this candidly because they didn't think they were in any danger. they said look, the world has
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changed. there's satellites, al ja sooer. when we see people asking for something, we get out in front of it so we can claim to create that change, but it's manufactured. it's a fiction of what it is people think they want. so it was a very carefully controlled system. now, you know, ultimately, it backfired. because the regime, they begin to believe some of their own lies. they believe that the situation was much more stable than it was. that's an important element of it. but others don't make those mistakes. take for example really maybe the most sophisticated, the chinese communist party. there, i was in china ten days after mubarak fell and i met with chinese party officials who told me who keeps the same person in charge for 30 years. who does that anymore? they're savvy enough to understand they need to understand the face of the
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regime after two terms. >> and as long as you're changing the face of the regime, as long as basically the financial interests are aligned with the head of power, it doesn't matter what it looks like, does it? >> that's right. and a will the of these regimes, a good analogy you can make, the way i felt in russia was that it was you know, it was kind of like chicago in the 1920s. >> yeah. wonderful book. it's like a real book. not all real books. this thing, this is what's going on right now, man. this is what's actually going on right now. well presented. thank you so much. congratulations on finishing this. sounds like a tremendous undertaking on your part. congratulations to you, jimmy, i apologize i didn't get you in with him. but you said your piece on syria. you kind of set the agenda today. >> no, that would be steve friedman. >> on the set, your passion -- >> okay. straight ahead, the town --
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bye, you guys. straight ahead, the town where you better watch your language. or get ready to pay for your potty mouth. the medicare debate continues in washington...
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are you -- >> one for a violation of the verbal statute. >> what the hell is that? >> you are fined one -- >> getting fined for spouting the he double hockey sticks. no longer the thing of sci-fi. if you're like demolition man or perhaps like me. you've been known to utter a little something blue from time to time, well, you might want to avoid the town of middlebrough, massachusetts. anyone caught swearing will be slapped with a $20 fine.
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i know. wtf. a couple of other fines aimed at cleaning up their act, drop a wrapper on a ground, 50 bucks. smoking a joint in public, 300 bucks. pretty sure it's -- outright illegal most other places. as for the foul language, first amendments are thinking, but apparently, the legal lines are blurrier than you think. the supreme court has ruled the government cannot bar public speech due to profanity, but massachusetts law currently allows towns to enforce local laws giving police the power to arrest anyone who quote addresses another person with profane or obscene language in a public place. in short, you're safest by following the example of our producer, nick, when he found out about my last day, show
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self-aware guy on a cell. send him a cloud. he's getting closer, closer. and oh, the clown goes right by without drawing so much of a look. is this for real? >> a clown riding a unicycle right past you in daylight on the sidewalk. how could you miss this? according to our next guest, there's a logical explanation why one person on the phone may miss the event. we're breaking it down with one of the experts features on head games, a final part airs this sunday. june 17th at 10:00 p.m. on the discovery channel. we were just chatting before the commercial and we don't really know all the variables that dictate, we have sort of linear analysis, but we don't know how the whole environment is working together in symphony, if you will.
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but we least seem to have some sense of why we don't like at the guy in the clown. >> it's true. we really don't know what we're talking about with connection to the brain and its behaviors, one of the interesting things about this experiment is people may know about those experiments, count the number of balls and meanwhile, a gorilla walks by and you miss it. here, all that's going on is that you have a cell phone. so guys on their cell phone, gals on their cell phone walking through a campus. >> an auditory stimulation is less -- another thing, by eye rs not being used. >> this clown is in fact, your visual system has the information. but for some reason, you don't see it even in the least and it's because that event is
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unrelated to the event you're hearing, it has no connection. if it did, you might r consider it part of the same event and pay attention. >> what does that teach us about context and reality to everything? in other words, if something -- have we the way we're using our brains. >> well, one way to respond is that these are the way that these experiments are done are such that we can focus on the clown and we realize, but it's even happening now. right now, there's cameras. and i'm not paying attention to them. if we stand to the side of a tennis court and watch 12 games sim ul tan yously, we can choose to focus on the fourth one down and we don't really think about it. the other stuff is all in front of our visual field. >> and in political context as well. >> see now you're a discovery channel scientist and cable
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political pundit for the 2012 elections. they told me you have a test you want to conduct with me on the set. is that correct? well hold on a second, you can't just start staring at me. you have to tell the audience. i don't stare at you, but i will not stare at you as the host of the show. >> it ruins it. >> the way this works on tv is we have to explain the experiment -- >> but it's more creepy. >> i understand, so let's try. we're going to test this. we're going to stare at each other and then after, we'll figure out what just happened. just want to audience to know so they don't think you're strange. >> it's too late. for you, you're not going to be creeped out. let's start. now it's well-known -- what are you doing with your lips there?
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very strange. no, if you do this for a long period of time, men and women will have feelings they like each other. >> they'll have sex, who are we kidding, doctor. food, sex -- staring means what? >> so, in the experiment we did here, we had people show up to getting an oil change an they sit down in a waiting room and are having a conversation. everyone else are actors. at some point t owner walks in and says here's a special card for you. after this point, a special gift card so, it changes. suddenly, everybody begins to stare. at first, the actor's instructions are to do it covertly. never let them know you're staring, but soon, it's ramped up so they're just full on staring and watching the reactions are fascinating. they're sweating, blushing. often you blush more on the side of the face people are looking at you. here, they were looking on all sides. what's interesting about looking
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at somebody, why do people react to this. if you listen to somebody or smell somebody, you're not really directing anything toward them, but if you touch someone, it's quite different. when you touch somebody, it's more getting into their space and not only that, they know you're touching them. looking at someone is similar. i'm examining you and when i touch you with my eyes, you know it. >> i feel you observing me. i don't necessarily feel you listening to me. if you're observing whoever the person -- >> and smell doesn't work that way, too. unless you're a dog. >> i don't feel your smelling me. we're not dogs. but the point is -- >> but your eyes have evolved to be easy to see. we've got these white eyes, so they're really easy to tell. when all these people are looking at this poor mark, the sukt, they're not even looking away. they're saying i know that you know we're looking at you and we don't care. >> that's almost either a
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confrontation, overture, it's something. >> that's right. they were instructed not to put any anger face. >> anybody do weird things with their lips like i did? >> no, because i wasn't in the room. >> that might be a unique thing that i just invented. put it on the show. do that with you, we'll submit it. a pleasure to know you. >> thank you. check him out. not only a brain expert, but you can catch him on tv playing these very head games sunday night, june 17th at 10:00 p.m. on the discovery channel. thank you for coming over to play with us and teach us a little bit. again, coming up on "hardball" tonight, jeb bush waying in on the state of the party. and they're also watching.
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dr. david goodfriend himself making the case for more private practices when it comes to your technology. our cloud is made of bedrock. concrete. and steel. our cloud is the smartest brains combating the latest security threats. it spans oceans, stretches continents. and is scalable as far as the mind can see. our cloud is the cloud other clouds look up to. welcome to the uppernet. i'd like to thank eating right, whole grain, multigrain cheerios! mom, are those my jeans? [ female announcer ] people who choose more whole grain tend to weigh less than those who don't. multigrain cheerios tend to weigh less than those who don't. like, keep one of these over your head. well, i wasn't "supposed" to need flood insurance, but i have it. fred over here chose not to have it. ♪ me, i've got a plan.
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david goodfriend here with a "daily rant." >> the less than spectacular facebook ipo raised plenty of questions about how our capital markets worked, but also got people talk about another potential casualty of social networks in the internet age. privacy. it seems ever more apparent than personal privacy will be under siege by the corporate bottom line. my name, my location. even musical preferences. they're all out there somewhere
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in the digital ecosystem and chances are, i have no idea who sees it and why. we americans have a long history of respecting personal privacy. it's right up there with liberty and apple pie, but our privacy laws are down right weird. our constitution enshrines privacy from government intrusion. the police cannot enter my house without a warrant, but on the other hand, there isn't a single basic law establishing for how companies or schools handles anyone's personal information. there's a set of rules for phone companies, cable companies, a set of rules for medical information and even another for video rental information. it's an incomprehensible mess. now, we get a lot of stuff for free on the internet because of advertising and that is usually
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tailored to us because of our information, but come on. we've got to be able to come up with some simple rules of the road that everybody else can live by. so if you collect my information, tell me. if i don't like it, let me out. if you want to use it for some reason, get my permission and if you use it for something else, get my permission for that. it's pretty simple. we're told it's koocomplicated. just try to read through the word bar on i-tunes. it doesn't have to be that indefifrable. sometimes, laws have to be complicated, but an issue like personal privacy, which you easily comprehend can be addressed with simple law. we can have that in this country if we want. now, the good new ss that even in this hyper partisan age, there's a lot of bipartisan agreement about the need to protect consumer's privacy online. the obama administration came out with a draft privacy bill of
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rights and texas republican congressman joe barton advocates for better protection of personal privacy, now, those are are two names you do not often see on the same side of an issue. so i hold out hope that this is one area where we're going to see some real productive real law making in the near future. >> i'll agree with you but for one question that might proffer. do the lawmakers themselves, are they vulnerable and their families and children and their daughters and sons to the same pre -- we are? >> but also benefit from being able to target campaign ads. >> they're not going to do it. >> i got ten seconds to say thank you for having me on the show so much. >> is this the end of the road for us? >> i'll be here next week, but after this, it's all up to you. >> we're going to tell the story next